Mythic Legions ART BOOK - May we get a current update?

Re: Mythic Legions ART BOOK - May we get a current update?

Postby ToDigAndBeDug » Sat May 25, 2019 10:47 pm

Satam wrote:
Not really. "They die" but "your party dies." While "they" is a third-person plural pronoun, "your party" counts as a third-person singular pronoun like "he" or "she," as it's considered one entity. Therefore, "dies" is correct. The phrasing, however, is not something that would at all be considered acceptable by AP or Chicago style standards. Then again, there is room for creative license, and it's very reminiscent of something you might hear in a Shakespeare play or even an old Errol Flynn movie, so it works well for the genre here.


I completely agree that “your party” counts as a third-person singular pronoun. It would be replaced by “it,” as in “It dies.” But that was never the matter at hand. The full subject of that clause is “you and all your party.” I misspoke earlier when I said that it would be replaced by “They die.” It should be “You [plural] die” or “You all die” or “You guys die.” Plural you still receives “die” and not “dies.” So it would be, “If the queen dies, you guys die.” The way it is written in the comic just sounds wrong to me. Am I just crazy?
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Re: Mythic Legions ART BOOK - May we get a current update?

Postby Satam » Sun May 26, 2019 10:58 am

ToDigAndBeDug wrote:
Satam wrote:
Not really. "They die" but "your party dies." While "they" is a third-person plural pronoun, "your party" counts as a third-person singular pronoun like "he" or "she," as it's considered one entity. Therefore, "dies" is correct. The phrasing, however, is not something that would at all be considered acceptable by AP or Chicago style standards. Then again, there is room for creative license, and it's very reminiscent of something you might hear in a Shakespeare play or even an old Errol Flynn movie, so it works well for the genre here.


I completely agree that “your party” counts as a third-person singular pronoun. It would be replaced by “it,” as in “It dies.” But that was never the matter at hand. The full subject of that clause is “you and all your party.” I misspoke earlier when I said that it would be replaced by “They die.” It should be “You [plural] die” or “You all die” or “You guys die.” Plural you still receives “die” and not “dies.” So it would be, “If the queen dies, you guys die.” The way it is written in the comic just sounds wrong to me. Am I just crazy?


While the alternatives you give are definitely correct on their own and sound better to modern ears (mine included), what's written is still grammatically correct for the reason I stated before. You are 100% correct that the subject of the clause is "you and all your party." But what you're missing is that "you" gets lumped in with "your party" in this instance (you are part of your party after all), and so it still counts as third-person singular and "dies" is still correct.
This brings me to what I think is the big thing that's hanging you up here, and it's something that I seem to have only just alluded to before, when maybe should have talked a little more about it. You're trying to rewrite it to put the verb after the subject as is the common and correct way of speaking and writing today. So by that standard, you are absolutely right, and it would be incorrect to say something like "You and all your party dies." It sounds silly. But the thing is, in archaic English, the verb could come before the subject, and in that case different rules applied. That's the other part of the reason why "so dies you and all your party," is totally acceptable even though it's not the proper way of speaking anymore.
It just sounds wrong to you because no one talks like that in the 21st century outside of maybe a Shakespeare play or a Pirates of the Caribbean movie. While not quite correct, you're definitely not crazy. If I came across this in an author's draft, nine times out of ten I would highlight it and add the comment "WHAT?" But this would be that tenth time where it's just fine and actually works quite well because of the book's genre. There were, however, as you very rightly pointed out before, so many other things wrong that made it into the published work that should have been fixed before it went to print. I would have been happy to fix all that for them just for a few figures or something, but it's too late now.
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Re: Mythic Legions ART BOOK - May we get a current update?

Postby boogieman4hire » Sun May 26, 2019 5:13 pm

Maybe Skapular talks like that because he's a bonehead.
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